This is an essay that’s been begging me to write it for weeks, ever since I got into River/Jayne fandom. How old is Jayne?
Most writers use Adam Baldwin’s age, which, when filming Firefly, was forty, and during Serenity, 43. Therefore, he’s usually portrayed as ‘mid-forties’ or somewhere in that range. However, I think he is younger than that, somewhere in his early- to mid-thirties.
I have several reasons for this theory. First, actors ages rarely correspond with characters’ ages. For example, Summer Glau was born in 1981, making her 24 when Serenity was released (and probably 23 when it was filmed) yet River is identified as 17. Almost all teen movies and shows star actors in their twenties: One Tree Hill, The OC, and hell, Patrick Swayze was 35 when he filmed Dirty Dancing. So, actor’s ages are largely useless when determining a character’s age.
Second, Jayne is a mercenary. He is in a very, very dangerous line of work. In the show and the movie, we’ve seen him shot, stabbed, and beat up more times than I can count. It seems unlikely that any mercenary would survive much past forty, let alone one as headstrong and brash as Jayne.
From what we know of his situation immediately previous to coming aboard Serenity, Jayne was being taken advantage of. I think a man who had been a mercenary for fifteen to twenty years at this point would know the going rate (we have no reason not to believe Mal and Zoë were lying about that in Out of Gas). However, if he’d only been working for a few years, it’s much more likely he wouldn’t know that.
Then of course, there’s his emotional maturity. As
naughtyvix put it, he has the emotional maturity of a blueberry scone. While I know there are men in their forties who still act like Jayne, especially unmarried ones in analogous occupations, they are much more rare than similar men in their thirties.
Lastly, there’s the issue of Jayne’s family. In ‘The Message,’ Jayne’s mother mentions Mattie, who is identified as Jayne’s younger brother in the shooting script. It’s implied, at least in my mind, that Mattie still lives with their parents, or at least near them. Most kids move out around age 18, so it’s likely Mattie is in his teens. While I do know one family in which there is a twenty-five year age gap between the oldest and youngest child, it’s not a common occurrence, even in very large families. A gap of 10-15 years is much more common, as it would be if Jayne were early/mid-thirties, and Mattie were in his late teens or early twenties. (Of course, if this is the scenario, Jayne probably has at least one sibling in between he and Mattie, probably several.)
I’d like to present an alternate timeline that I think much better captures Jayne’s age than the common early/mid-forties scenario. When he was 18-21, he left home, looking for something new/work/whatever. Or maybe he didn’t leave home, but took a common job at home: farming, mining, manufacturing, etc. He probably took a few small, legitimate jobs, but found they didn’t pay well enough to both support him, and send money home (which we see he does in ‘The Message’). This probably takes a couple of years. So, he turns to a life of crime around age 23-24, probably working independently or with a partner. This includes Stitch from ‘Jaynestown,’ so it would last up until at least five years before he joined Serenity. Maybe that was his last job before joining up as a merc; maybe he realized he just didn’t have the head for planning, so he joined a gang. Let’s say he’s 27 when he does so: old enough to admit his own failings as a criminal mastermind, and probably scarier looking than any 23-year-old could be. He’s got experience, he’s bigger and he’s meaner than when he left home. The crew of Serenity picks him up a few years later, making him about 30 or 31. Assuming he’s been with Serenity a year or two (most sites put it at one year, as per ‘Our Mrs. Reynolds’ and making sure that ‘Jaynestown’ is five years after leaving Stitch) he’s squarely in his early/mid-thirties during both the series and the movie.
Discuss! ^_^
Crossposted all over:
meinterrupted,
rayne_shippers,
rayne_fanon,
ff_fanfic,
manthycalljayne. I'm linking back to my journal to keep all the discussion in one place, and so people can debate with each other as well. If anyone wants to link this to other Jayne communities, feel free.
ETA:
vandonovan has posted the most well-put and thought out rebuttal so far here. I, unfortunetly, do not have time to reply to his/her comment, because I'm driving home, but you should all read it. There are several good points there that I hadn't thought of.
Most writers use Adam Baldwin’s age, which, when filming Firefly, was forty, and during Serenity, 43. Therefore, he’s usually portrayed as ‘mid-forties’ or somewhere in that range. However, I think he is younger than that, somewhere in his early- to mid-thirties.
I have several reasons for this theory. First, actors ages rarely correspond with characters’ ages. For example, Summer Glau was born in 1981, making her 24 when Serenity was released (and probably 23 when it was filmed) yet River is identified as 17. Almost all teen movies and shows star actors in their twenties: One Tree Hill, The OC, and hell, Patrick Swayze was 35 when he filmed Dirty Dancing. So, actor’s ages are largely useless when determining a character’s age.
Second, Jayne is a mercenary. He is in a very, very dangerous line of work. In the show and the movie, we’ve seen him shot, stabbed, and beat up more times than I can count. It seems unlikely that any mercenary would survive much past forty, let alone one as headstrong and brash as Jayne.
From what we know of his situation immediately previous to coming aboard Serenity, Jayne was being taken advantage of. I think a man who had been a mercenary for fifteen to twenty years at this point would know the going rate (we have no reason not to believe Mal and Zoë were lying about that in Out of Gas). However, if he’d only been working for a few years, it’s much more likely he wouldn’t know that.
Then of course, there’s his emotional maturity. As
Lastly, there’s the issue of Jayne’s family. In ‘The Message,’ Jayne’s mother mentions Mattie, who is identified as Jayne’s younger brother in the shooting script. It’s implied, at least in my mind, that Mattie still lives with their parents, or at least near them. Most kids move out around age 18, so it’s likely Mattie is in his teens. While I do know one family in which there is a twenty-five year age gap between the oldest and youngest child, it’s not a common occurrence, even in very large families. A gap of 10-15 years is much more common, as it would be if Jayne were early/mid-thirties, and Mattie were in his late teens or early twenties. (Of course, if this is the scenario, Jayne probably has at least one sibling in between he and Mattie, probably several.)
I’d like to present an alternate timeline that I think much better captures Jayne’s age than the common early/mid-forties scenario. When he was 18-21, he left home, looking for something new/work/whatever. Or maybe he didn’t leave home, but took a common job at home: farming, mining, manufacturing, etc. He probably took a few small, legitimate jobs, but found they didn’t pay well enough to both support him, and send money home (which we see he does in ‘The Message’). This probably takes a couple of years. So, he turns to a life of crime around age 23-24, probably working independently or with a partner. This includes Stitch from ‘Jaynestown,’ so it would last up until at least five years before he joined Serenity. Maybe that was his last job before joining up as a merc; maybe he realized he just didn’t have the head for planning, so he joined a gang. Let’s say he’s 27 when he does so: old enough to admit his own failings as a criminal mastermind, and probably scarier looking than any 23-year-old could be. He’s got experience, he’s bigger and he’s meaner than when he left home. The crew of Serenity picks him up a few years later, making him about 30 or 31. Assuming he’s been with Serenity a year or two (most sites put it at one year, as per ‘Our Mrs. Reynolds’ and making sure that ‘Jaynestown’ is five years after leaving Stitch) he’s squarely in his early/mid-thirties during both the series and the movie.
Discuss! ^_^
Crossposted all over:
ETA:
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Comments
You should! If you think of anything about Jayne or any other character, post it! I can't seem to find much evidence for anyone else's ages, though I will certainly be looking. ^_^
Jayne's age has ALWAYS bothered me. Not that Adam isn't a complete and total HOTTIE at 42-43 (he will be 44 in February! and I lurve him sooooo much!), but for a Merc to live that long...well it just doesn't seem plausible. Jayne even mentions that a Merc's life expectancy is pretty short to Book in "The Message"!
And really, on a post at the official site someone mentioned that the companion novel (I think that was it) states that Mal is 50! FIFTY!!!!!! WHAT THE HELL? Now, unless we got some fandom crossover where the translator microbes are causing the Humans to have Sebacean length life-spans...SOOOOO not buying that one either!
Okay, Mal is definitely not fifty. There's no frakin' way he's fifty. I need to get my hands on this novel, so I can smack some sense into that author.
My friends and I guess Simon to be around 24 to 26, but there's no real canon evidence that I can think of, really. We know River is 17, and in the flashbacks in "Safe" it seems that she's 5 or 6 while Simon is about... 12-14? A six year difference between them would make Simon 23 in the series at the youngest... which is just boggling, but makes a degree of sense. Poor boy. No wonder he's so terrified.
That'd be awfully young to've already been an established doctor, of course, but we all know Simon's gifted, and I could easily see him (and his parents) pushing himself as hard as possible. A friend of mine is a 2nd year med student, and there's a girl in her class who just turned 22, so... it's concievable.
Excellent essay. < 3
twono,threefour incidences in the movie... and I'm sure I am missing something... there's gotta be one more.. Oh! He got electrocuted by a futuristic dumpster in "Trash". Can you think of anything else? Hehe.What do you mean by this? (Not trying to be snippy, just don't understand.)
I meant that if he was actually in the midforties, still whoring/drinking/fighting/etc, he wouldn't be as accurate or as fast when on jobs. It takes a lot out of somebody to live that hard. *raises hand* I'm a doctor, and I've seen lots of problems in patients that abuse their bodies and don't get medical care. After someone drinks that much for long periods of time, there's all sorts of problems that can develop. Some of them can affect balance and coordination.
He certainly wasn't an amateur during his first visit to Janestown.
What makes you say he wasn't an amatuer during Jaynestown? He made a rather stupid mistake, letting his ship be compromised without some sort of backup, something a more experienced thief would probably have. And besides, in my timeline, he's not really an amatuer: three years (give or take) at a job isn't a newbie, but it's not an expert either.
Actually, Mattie is identified as Jayne's younger brother in the shooting script. I don't have the link, and can't really look for it (I'm having computer problems at the moment, but I'm sure googling will work). As for the age gap, that's assuming he HAS a large family. I think he has at least two siblings, but the only family I know in which there is a 20-year age gap has 11 kids. I don't think Jayne has that many younger siblings; I think with a family like that, he'd be much more loyal and protective.
These are all just things I've thought about. Not all my proofs are super-strong, but put together, I think I've made a pretty good case. You're certainly free to have a different opinion than me. :)
I personally put Jayne somewhere just past 36. No real reason other than I liked using a line that said he'd spent as many years in the black as he had on his home planet.
Assuming the lifespan of a merc wouldn't be much past forty is a bit problematic for me. Where did we all pick up that number anyway?
The 'verse in Firefly is analagous to the post-Civil War United States. Life expectancy in the wild west during that time period was very low; I can't find a specific age, but only 2.5% of Americans made it to 65 (from here). Even with better medication and surgical tecniques, those people on the Rim (analagous to the west) would have limited access to them, making their life expectancy very low.
So, let's assume that the average settler on the rim lives to 60; lower than those in the Core, by a lot probably, but not that low. Add in all the dangers inherent in crime: guns, knives, police, shady partners, etc. That would lower the average life expectancy significantly, maybe by as much as 15 years. Add this to the documented phenomena that criminals think mainly in the short term, causing them to take impulsive risks (from here) and you've got a recipe for dying young.
As for forty, it's a good round number. Humans like round numbers. It's also old enough to have lived a good life, but not so old that one couldn't still do the job. Can you see a fifty-year-old merc? I can't, really; a boss, certainly, but the muscle? Not likely.
But, in regards to Jayne, I eventually reverted back to the Jayne-is-as-old-as-Adam-theory. This is some of the reasons why: I like the concept that mercs don't live very long and that Jayne is supposively rather slow and dimwitted and thus it's unexpected that he would be alive that long-- but I think the fact that he is older than expected and is still alive is intriguing! I really enjoy that idea. He's better than people suspect and his still being alive (and in such relative health) is a tribute to how GREAT he is as a merc.
I also think that although he's got a more youthful mentality than we might expect of a 40-something guy that a lot of that is his charm. Jayne is slow and youthful and silly. I wish more 40 year olds were like that! I think that "dumbing down" his age does Jayne a discredit . . . because, to me (in my fiction, etc.) those years are hard-earned and well spent. He hit 35 and thought he'd die and every year after that he's pretty much expected that "This'll be the year."
Additionally, I'm not a Jayne/River 'shipper but I do 'ship him and, of course, everyone I 'ship him with is younger than him (as I don't write Book/Jayne). At first it bothered me to have him older than, say, Malcolm. I thought, you know, what merc is gonna take orders from this young captain kid? (And, according to actor ages, Jayne, Zoe and Wash are all older than Mal.) But then I thought, well, there's another dynamic. It's something else interesting to work into the relationship between the characters. I can see the same struggle existing between Jayne and River. How do you reconcile the love-interest between a 17-year-old girl and a 40-something-guy without making it creepy? Ay, there's the rub! You have to make it work. And when you do get it to work the payoff it so much better.
Also, I don't buy the Mal-is-fifty timeline. I think there is a general consensus going around that the last two digits of his birthday were transposed on those documents. (I believe he's listed as being born in 2568, which made him 50-ish during Firefly but if he was born in 2586 that makes him 32-ish during Firefly and that lines him up right next to Wash in terms of birthtimes.)
Anyway, my biggest issue with the Jayne birthday thing is the extremes people go to reverse it. I'm generally not bothered when he's turned from 40 to 35 or so. What's five years at that point in life? But I've seen fics where he's decidedly younger than Mal, upwards of 10 years or so, to the point that Mal calls him "boy" or whatever. I can buy Jayne being 35--I can't buy him being 25.
I would absolutely love a definitive timeline of ages and dates that made sense because, at present, I'm not happy with the official stuff, and, like you, I am a stickler for accuracy (hence why I've stuck to the actor ages, for the most part). I'd also love a statement of actual heights -- IS or ISN'T Wash shorter than Zoe? Alan is taller than Gina but he's always filmed as looking shorter than Gina. Aaaaugh.
The only other way I can reconcil this is if, in the future, despite all the Western-motifs we have going, the average life-expectancy is much higher than we're used to. In that Mal is fifty and looks 30 and Jayne is 40 and looks 30, etc. And Book is pushing 80, maybe, hahaha.
Anyway, good essay.
River is 17 (as stated in Serenity Part 1's shooting script and Serenity the film)
Kaylee is 19 or 20 (as stated by Joss and Jewel)
Simon is roughly seven years older then River, making him 23-25. (based on 'young Simon' and 'young River' from 'Safe')
Mal is about 32. (based on Serenity, the film.)
I would put Inara as early to mid 20s. Zoe as early to mid-30s. Wash as early to mid-30s. And Jayne as 33-36. Book is 60s, I think.
I really wish Joss would just state how old everyone is. It would make things so much easier.
So do I! We never had this issue in Buffy. Gah. I think I'm going to write out my own timeline, basing characters' ages off my own observations instead of actor's birthdays. As soon as I write the story that my muse has been beating me over the head with.
I know! Buffy, Xander, Cordelia, and Willow (and Anya) were all the same ages. Oz was a year older. Dawn was younger, 14-17 in the series. Giles and Joyce were 40s-50s. Jenny was 30s. Spike, Angel, Darla, and Dru were all 100s, 200s, or 400s. lol
I did the same thing, actually. It was just based on my thoughts, etc. It's really worked out well for me.
If you have a different site, I'd love to see a link. :)
I don't think it's wishful thinking to imagine that Jayne's around 35, I'd actually prefer him to be 40, not only for the excellent reasons stated above, but also because I think older guys are hot. (What? Shut up.) Anyway, I've got friends who are in their early forties and they really aren't that different than people in their early thirties. They're more mature than I am (mid-20's), but they're still silly and immature sometimes. Of course, they're still single or childless. I think parenthood might be more of a maturing factor than actual chronological aging for a lot of people.
In terms of his survival, Book believed that Jayne would be around long after them, and seeing as how I believe Book is extremely perceptive, I can see how Jayne would pass the big 40 to start pushing towards 50.
In terms of River/Jayne I don't think 5 years makes a difference when the age gap is that large between them. If someone doesn't like it, it isn't going to make them feel better that Jayne got younger by 5 years.
But in terms of his age in general, I believe part of the reason Jayne is the way he is, is because of the fact that he left home early and started killing soon after that.
I think he's in his 30's just cause it's this feeling I get. It had nothing to do with not liking that he's older(hell Adam Baldwin's hot...he's 43) it's just an instinct.
I would like to suggest that Jayne might even be a bit younger than 35ish. You mentioned that you believe he would have left home at around 18-21. While this is a reasonable assumption, I have always pictured Jayne leaving home closer to 16 years old.
My reasons for my assumption are that Jayne more than likely came from a poor, rural to sub-urban area. In such areas, it is common for males to leave home as soon as other males in the family (younger brothers and the like) can care for the family. While this may be around marriage age (18ish), if the boy is particularly head strong or believes there is more to life than what he has lived, he will often leave home several years earlier.
I conjecture that he lives in a more rural area because of his speech patterns in comparison to the rest of the crew. Obviously, Simon, Inara, and Book have very educated speech patterns. Zoe, Wash, and Mal make up another possible tier of education/social opportunities. Then Jayne and Kaylee are the closest linked after the rest. It is implied that Kaylee doesn't have much in the way of formal education because of a lack of funds; her father doesn't always make enough to make ends meet.
If Kaylee and Jayne are linked at a socio/economic/education level, then we can infer that Jayne lacked money and education when young, which would possibly instill in him a desire to leave and be responsible for himself as soon as he felt he could and the chance arose.
...yeah. I apologize for the length, but you got me thinking, and now I've gone nutso with it. B-)